Intending To Make Mistakes

Denver Snuffer stated in http://denversnuffer.com/2015/11/a-gospel-of-christ/ when referring to Joseph Smith making contradicting histories of his first vision, that  "I... intend to make different mistakes".

Denver has said much about not wanting people to follow or depend too much upon him. I find it interesting that so many are so interested in nearly every thing he writes or states on most every subject, except for his pre-2014 statements on the history of plural marriage (specifically all the posts he wrote on his blog in June 2012). Snuffer plainly explained that Joseph Smith was involved with Plural Marriage. That D&C 132 is a collection of revelations given to Joseph (with just a few word changes by Brigham Young). That Joseph Smith obtained calling and election and merited the sealing power for being obedient to the command for him to live it. Snuffer plainly explained how God does allow some of His people to have plural wives (if commanded, or allowed for those who have sealing authority), and that the un-authorized by God living of plural marriage is an abomination. After 2014, he seems to change his tone on the topic, as if he is trying to allow people to now assume Joseph never lived it and that plural marriage is always an abomination. He states that Joseph did not commit adultery. I agree. I still agree even if Joseph Smith actually had relations with some of his plural wives (William Clayton had a son while Joseph was alive in Nauvoo, and others had children from plural wives like Abraham, Jacob/Israel and others in our scriptures). For me, I look at every statement Snuffer makes on the topic, and look at it all as a whole. If something contradicts, I ask why. As any one should. All this reminds me of when the Lord said I come not to bring piece, but a sword. A two-edged sword that cuts both ways.

On Nov. 1st I emailed and asked Denver what he meant when he stated on his blog October 31st that "God does not justify carnal relations except between one man and his one wife". His reply came a couple hours later. I feel safe only sharing what Denver states publicly. I can say one comment agrees with his pre-2014 statements on the topic and I so would love to share it here. On Nov. 4th he posted a blog and only mentioned one of the many things he had stated to me privately. That one thing was about Cain (should read the seed of Cain) being the first one recorded in the biblical record to live it. He stated in his blog "...the adulterous taking of multiple wives is a pattern originated by Cain and later imitated by Brigham Young". I also agree with Snuffer with this statement. Obviously a murderer like cain or his son lamech is not allowed to be one of God's people who can rightly be authorized to live such a system. Denver had stated in the past that the un-authorized taking of multiple wives is adulterous and abominable, and I agree. He also said the practice/teaching of PM that Brigham Young warped it into (and carried on by the different fundamentalist groups and independents) needs to come to an end, - I also agree with.

In his recent Mormon History talk found here: http://denversnuffer.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Mormon-History.pdf Snuffer reminds us that he will talk more about some topics as promised. Snuffer had previously told me in person, at the end of the St George Lecture in 2014, that he will explain more about this topic, after I commented to him that he stated some can be allowed or commanded to live as he discussed in his book Passing The Heavenly Gift and on his blog (for heavens sakes actually read what he wrote on the topic in PTHG chapter 6 - his words there also agree with his many blog posts and other lectures). Likely a topic to fully explain when people are ready to actually digest it all properly. After some make a public display of their own judgemental and divisive weaknesses, and others learn to forgive them for it I suppose. Another test to pass? Some more filtering going on? More foundational Kingdom teachings need to be understood first?
Snuffer not explaining it all now, is enough to help others understand that there is something hard to share on this topic that most are not ready for. If Joseph Smith did not actually live this familial system, just like Abraham, Jacob, Moses and others had... then why not simply say so and clearly settle the case? That explanation seems easy.

Now if you read my "Sorting IT Out" post, you will recognize that I had some serious questions about Denver's statement on Oct 31st about acceptable relations should only be between a man and his wife. Denver's comment there was more geared to open relations (like the secret adulterous/fornicative spiritual wifery that Bennett and Higby and others were doing after they HAD heard a little about Joseph's authorized plural marriages) and gay relations. But the one man and one woman comment (along with his other recent contradictory, anti-accept plural marriage principle statements the past year) was enough to push me to contact him. In 2010 I had quite a few conversations with him via email. But he told me to read all his books first and stopped replying to me and other friends later that same year. He was busy with his books and lots of people were starting to contact him. I hadn't received a reply from him in years. I didn't know if I would get a response. My main question to him on Nov. 1st was "Are you saying no one in our day... could be be 132 justified like you use to write prior to 2014?" After getting one response from him, there was one little vague statement that really caught me off guard and caused some serious confusion. That statement, paired with his recent image of God being a man and a woman statements, caused me to take it to the Lord on Nov 1st. An answer came the next day. It was additional information I had not understand on top of the years of research and understanding I already had on the topic. I did not like it. I was hoping I had received false revelation. I was hoping what Denver had been saying publicly and privately to me was incorrect. Hoping there was a mistake intentionally being made by him. I went back to the scriptures in D&C 132 and Jacob ch 2. Certain words seemed to jump out at me and made more sense than ever. I still struggled with the new information.

Well, I wanted clarification, some confirmation on my possible revelation that was causing me so much confusion. Good or bad for doing so, it didn't matter at the time. I was eager to settle it. I emailed some follow up questions and responses. 2 or 3 emails were sent to him for a couple weeks. No reply. He only made a public post about cain's seed living it in the Bible, and recently gave more subtle little hints, but not much was really expressed in his Mormon History talk and paper that came out yesterday... where he again states that more details will be given in the future. That could be a public answer to show he wants to put off answerering my private questions, but I really wanted clarification from him on his own reply he had made to me and to see if I was heading towards further light or darkness on the topic. I was still in a bit of mental agony for those three weeks. Too many questions. Too many contradictions with scripture and some of Joseph Smith's words and actions (if and where recorded accurately). Too many buts and what ifs.

On Nov. 22nd, while having a nice spiritual Sunday afternoon, I was again reading chapter 6 of Passing the Heavenly Gift. Denver's use and quoting of the words from D&C 132. I looked at the D&C 132 verses again. I stared out the window as I often do to ponder. I ask. How can some of God's people (as stated in Jacob 2 and as Denver had stated about Joseph living it) be allowed to live plural marriage in mortality, if there is only one man and one woman in God's Kingdom (image of God end state of being)? Why would God permit something for time only? Only one Queen out of all of the wives of all those great prophets of the past make it with one King/Man? The other wives who don't make queenship, are recycled into another mortality in another creation cycle and have no claim at all on their man they had hopes and expectations to be with in eternity? Why was Joseph sealing plural wives to himself, even some who were married for time, if they do not go with him in God's Kingdom/eternity? These were the questions for three weeks that were bothering me. How could my new understanding jive with what Joseph apparantly did, what Abraham, Isaac and Jacob lived? How could my own previous revelations on the matter agree with the new understanding? Something must be amiss. Was I deceived somewhere? Where? Is Denver intending to be contradictory intentionally to keep people from relying too much upon him and not enough on the Lord? 

I ponder some more. Some information began flowing. All I can say is that the explanations that went on for some time was one of the biggest relief or ah-hah moments I've had. It made more sense. It relaxed my little mental agony going on for weeks. Boy does Snuffer have some things to explain in the future. Some questions still remain, but I think I got enough to help settle my mind. We have to first understand single salvation vs couple exaltation, sealing authority, raising up seed to the Lord (in all the many different ways), reflect on C&E promises, realize that some standings in eternity are not "eternal" or forever but in deed more glorious a standing than being recycled into another mortal probation in a different creation period, etc. 

I hope this helps to relieve the minds of some friends that are really struggling with recent comments Snuffer has been saying on this certain topic. They are personally living this familial system. (No, I am not, nor am I looking to. And yes, I have been falsely accused of wanting to add another LDS remnant community member into my family... for simply trying to explain scriptural and church history and my understandings on this topic).

As Snuffer stated in his paper this week on Mormon History, the answers do come if you keep pondering and asking. Some of the words he used in his paper actually matched some of the exact words the Lord had used to explain some things to me on Nov. 22nd.
Answers happen. It may take some time to be prepared to see it, and likely will be given here and there, when you are ready to receive it. Many topics take some foundational ideas to first be understood, before really seeing the bigger picture.
 
Anyways, go to the Lord to confirm and for explanations. They come. Through the veil process is a harder ordeal (it really is info given to your spirit from the Spirit which has to trickle down via hard to hear words and enlightenment into your mortal understanding) but I see the wisdom in it. Part of the journey. The mortal man still wishes the Lord would just reveal Himself in the flesh and explain things easily and quickly. Sure would be cool to go up and hang with Moses and other angels like Denver and others have done! Would to God that we were all near or on that level.
It is so much easier to understand a greater view of things, when you peer into eternity for a few minutes and get a fuller explanation. 
 
Sometimes frustration for a time can keep motivating you to keep seeking for answers.
Snuffer could explain the truth on the topic now. I could try to explain what I now understand. Snuffer obviously has reasons not to dive too far into it at this time, otherwise he would have cleared things up. I see the wisdom in not declaring it openly. I am sure there is more to learn, but I am satisfied for now. My increase of intelligence on the matter is comforting. I'm sure there is more to learn, seems there always is! Frustration is not always a bad thing, it can be motivational.
 
I am just another fool on the same trek. A trek I have been on since 2008 after discovering what is really necessary to live in God's Kingdom forever. I have had some revelations through the veil. Had a couple visions. Had very small conversations spiritually, thru the veil with Angels (hey maybe some physical ones unaware). Understandings have increased over time with a little here and a little there. I remember for about 2 yrs being woken up numerous times hearing some kind of scripture-like instruction being given that I wish my mortal mind could diligently receive and remember. Have felt un-explainable glorious things at times and realized later what it meant. I have had some failures. I have also faced evil things that I never thought possible and don't want to discuss. I have seen hell do all they can through weaknesses of others close to me. Have heard great things that I sometimes think cannot be. I still to this day lament and desire with all my heart to be much further along the path than I am, as I am sure most probably feel.
 
But I want and am willing to understand all things. Wading in the deep end is not a problem for me either. I seek and ask always. If I lack intelligent understanding, I want it. If I misunderstand anything, I want correction. If the Lord has something to show me I need to work on, I want to hear it. I don't get offended if people don't yet understand what I do or have a different opinion on a topic (maybe a little bothered at personal opinions expressed that show a lack of research/pondering). I will not stop meeting with you or falsely assume negative things about you for trying to figure out some truth (this has happened to me in our growing LDS remnant community that hopes to one day be a part of Zion).
 
Hold to the Rod, He wants you to weary Him. He wants you to take your questions to Him. If Snuffer or others don't want to share something, go to the Lord and do all to pierce that veil (yes, it sometimes seems like a solid brick wall). Never give up, no matter how hard things in your life become, or how distant you think you are to Him. No matter how confused you are on some topic. Questions and misunderstandings are an opportunity. Problems that the adversary is allowed to cause you while on your trek are also opportunities. Take them as they come, and endure them well. Your salvation and/or exaltation depends on it.
 
To the truth, and nothing but. I care less about the misunderstandings and opinions of men. What I really want is the truth on everything I can, from The Source.